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Post by tecmosuperbowler on Aug 20, 2011 21:51:45 GMT -5
Buffalo trades away: WR Roddy White 35Age 95OVR 6yrs/36 Cap
Saints trades away: DE Wilson Jordan 27AGE 89OVR 2yrs/18cap
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Post by lions11 on Aug 20, 2011 22:07:21 GMT -5
Nawlans acccepts.
Gain 6 points in OVR ratings, but take on twice as much in cap. Age isnt a factor at this point.
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Post by lions11 on Aug 20, 2011 22:51:30 GMT -5
for those on the deny side, please explain.
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Post by confuzius on Aug 20, 2011 23:13:26 GMT -5
DEs are cheap, WRs are the most valuable position in the game outside QBs.
FA consistently bears this out. There are 7 ends on a buyer's market right now that are comparable in production to Jordan.
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Post by lions11 on Aug 20, 2011 23:26:48 GMT -5
production relies on a lot of things, I'm not sure if that a fair measure of how they are in a sim.
I thought someone denying would be saying Jordan is too much. the 18 extra cap is enough to land a stud in FA. I was able to get a 95 OVR for just 22 last season. With this being a much deeper FA class than last season, he should have no problem getting a low 90/high 80 OVR guy with that extra space.
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Post by confuzius on Aug 20, 2011 23:40:33 GMT -5
production relies on a lot of things, I'm not sure if that a fair measure of how they are in a sim. I thought someone denying would be saying Jordan is too much. the 18 extra cap is enough to land a stud in FA. I was able to get a 95 OVR for just 22 last season. With this being a much deeper FA class than last season, he should have no problem getting a low 90/high 80 OVR guy with that extra space. WR?
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Post by lions11 on Aug 20, 2011 23:43:36 GMT -5
production relies on a lot of things, I'm not sure if that a fair measure of how they are in a sim. I thought someone denying would be saying Jordan is too much. the 18 extra cap is enough to land a stud in FA. I was able to get a 95 OVR for just 22 last season. With this being a much deeper FA class than last season, he should have no problem getting a low 90/high 80 OVR guy with that extra space. WR? WR what? Theres an 85 OVR WR sitting in FA.
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Post by confuzius on Aug 20, 2011 23:55:01 GMT -5
One and he sucks....
If you cannot see the valuation of WRs, let alone a true #1 WR, versus DEs as illustrated by the FA market that exists right now then I can't explain it to you.
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Post by tommybomb789 on Aug 20, 2011 23:58:47 GMT -5
somewhat like confuzis said.. in every draft it seems there are 2 85+ DE's i also grabbed a 90 DE last FA for 18 points. you cant get a 90+ WR for less than 25 it seems. WR's just have more value in my opinion
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Post by confuzius on Aug 21, 2011 0:11:46 GMT -5
somewhat like confuzis said.. in every draft it seems there are 2 85+ DE's i also grabbed a 90 DE last FA for 18 points. you cant get a 90+ WR for less than 25 it seems. WR's just have more value in my opinion There are eight 80+ ends on the market who all can produce comparably to Jordan. If you did your homework, there are probably a couple of high 70 DEs who would also have a shot at the same production. OVR 77 Austen Lane outproduced Jordan last season. If I had not posted this fact, I probably could have gotten him for 3-4 cap.
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Post by lions11 on Aug 21, 2011 2:34:31 GMT -5
There are eight 80+ ends on the market who all can produce comparably to Jordan. If you did your homework, there are probably a couple of high 70 DEs who would also have a shot at the same production. OVR 77 Austen Lane outproduced Jordan last season. If I had not posted this fact, I probably could have gotten him for 3-4 cap. The "outproduced" argument means nothing. Its all relative to the players around them. You're judging him by the amount of tackles hes putting up, and obviously his will be less when surrounded by the other guys on the Saints defense (off last season, Ellis is a top 2 DT, Freeney tied for the top DE, Wake is top 2 at his spot, Durst and Griffin were both above league average) And if you did your homework, by the same logic, Roddy White was "outproduced" by 83 OVR Antonio Brown. And Drew Brees, 95 OVR, has been consistently in near the bottom of the league, well below other average QBs. And as for the ease of finding a DE of equal/better rating that someone brought up - Jordan is a top 3 RE, and top 5 overall.
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Post by kingbryk on Aug 21, 2011 6:44:26 GMT -5
true #1 wr will cost more then a DE. hence what i paid for AJ.
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Post by Getsum47 (Raiders) on Aug 21, 2011 13:13:20 GMT -5
I don't really see whats so wrong with the trade... When your in cap trouble and have a player who is sucking it up you have to take a lower caliber player in order to move him. While I think Jordan is crappy solution because he sucks for cap too. If that's the best offer he is getting for White then he should be good to take it. Kind of like the Panthers trade last year. This years Troy is FA so if he would have gotten rid of him last year he would have kept St. John and still had Lincoln basically for Fitzgerald who is over paid as well.
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Post by confuzius on Aug 21, 2011 16:27:03 GMT -5
I don't really see whats so wrong with the trade... When your in cap trouble and have a player who is sucking it up you have to take a lower caliber player in order to move him. While I think Jordan is crappy solution because he sucks for cap too. If that's the best offer he is getting for White then he should be good to take it. Kind of like the Panthers trade last year. This years Troy is FA so if he would have gotten rid of him last year he would have kept St. John and still had Lincoln basically for Fitzgerald who is over paid as well. This is the most compelling argument. My thoughts are still that you can find a comparable DE on the FA market this year for a lot cheaper, and either use White to trade for a position which cannot be filled in FA, or cut him. If you cut him you end up with an additional 13-15 cap space over the trade proposed here. It is a borderline trade, and the only reason there was so much discussion is because Lions asked for an explanation, and couldn't handle the fact that someone doesn't think like him. So simple solution, I won't explain myself to him next time. BTW Lions, my front 7 was equal to yours last season, and Ziggy Hood 83 OVR who I got for 8 cap outperformed Jordan.
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Post by lions11 on Aug 21, 2011 17:55:00 GMT -5
Thanks for the approvals.
@ confuzius, its a discussion. I dont see why you are upset about it.
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